Fuchs oud type gezocht

[67driver]

Goedenmiddag,

Voor mijn 1967 911, welke de restauratiefase bijna doorlopen heeft, ben ik opzoek naar een setje fuchs velgen. Mij is verteld er zouden 4,5J fuchsen onder horen maar wat mij betreft is 5,5J of 6J ook in orde.
Must is dat het oud type velgen zijn (zogenaamde deep dish?) met de diepe velgrand.

Heb je iets aan te bieden mail dan liefst met foto en prijs naar: 1967.911@gmail.com

[911_2.2T]

Op ebay duitsland is een set te koop:
http://cgi.ebay.de/Porsche-911-Fuchsfel ... 240%3A1318

[67driver]

Top! bedankt voor de tip. Hoe zou die ene te repareren zijn? Prijs is dat een beetje normaal voor deze fietswielen? m.a.w. Welke waarde moet ik voor welke breedte aanhouden of is dat allemaal een beetje gelijk? Ik ben een totale onbekende als het gaat om velgen dus hulp is welkom.

[Bertroex]

Je hebt een 1967?? Mooi zo:
van augustus '66 tot july 1967, (dus met de 4.5 fuchs) zag het design er zo uit:







Na augustus 1967 (dus vanaf de 5.5 inch) zag het design er zo uit (dus met meer zwart satinblack paint) :






eerstens: http://www.early911.co.uk/html/fuchs_rims.html

tweedens:

I'm just blatantly copying Peter Morgan's " Original Porsche 911"

2 litre models:

There were quite a few complaints about the skinny 165HR tyres fitted to [the 4.5jx15 steel wheels of the original 911. And for 1967, the new S ismayed Car and Driver by still using 4.5 inch rims for its "flashy new wheels"., and the magazine was none too complimetary about the dunlop SP tyres either. These new wheels, manufactured by the Fuchs Company, were the first of the classic five-spoke forged allys wheels that would become a porsche trademark in later years. In 4.5 in width, the alloys were 2.3kg (5.lb) lighter then their steel equivalents, and roundness was easier to contral than wit a stamped wheel. Clearly, the weight advantage of alloys was to increase as wheel rim width grew. So strong was the obsession to reduce unsprung weight that even the wheel nuts were light alloy, and still are today.

It was not until august 1967 that 5.5 in rims became available for the S, and the size grew again to 6in for the E and the S with the following year's B programme.
Where hydro-pneumatic suspension was fitted, ride was further improved by 5 and1/2 x 14 fuchs wheels, the 1 inch reduction in wheel diameter giving a deeper and more flexible tyre wall.

Dunlop tyres were still the preferred fit for the T and E with the new 185/70VR size. The S went one better and was offered with new Michelin XVR's, tyres that significantly improved the cornering ability of the firmly -sprung car.

2.2 series

Again Morgan:
The 6j x 15 fuchs wheel became the usual fit across the range of models, not only because these wheels had become synonymous with Porsche and its success, but also because the other size that was available as an option - a 14 inch rim- was generally unpopular.

The smaller wheel was produced to allow fitment of 85-series tyres, which had more flexible side walls than the 70-series tyres. The 14 inch rim was fitted to sportomatics to start with, but many customers wanted to stay with the 15 inch wheels-and the firmer ride that went with them. The 14 inch wheels were options on the T through 1970 and 1971, and were then deleted.

On the T in many markets, the 5.5J x 15 steels wheels was still the standard offering, but few customers wanted these old-fashioned wheels. The standard tyre for the T was the 165HR 15, but the 185/70 VR15 option was much more popular. The 185HR 14 was also available.

For the 2.4 litre models:

The standard factory fitting on the T for the 1972 and 1973 model years was the 5.5Jx15 non-chromed steel wheel with Dunlop CB57 165/70VR tyres. The E used 6jx 15 steel wheels in some markets with Dunlop CB57 185/70VR tyres, while the S continued to use the (five times) more expensive 6jx15 fuchs forged alloy wheels (an option for the other models) with michelin XVR 185/70VR tyres. In several markets, the forged alloy wheels were fitted to the T and E as standard.

Earlier experiments with the Stuttgart-based Mahle ocmpany into magnesium casting had led directly to the development of a cast aluminium alloy wheel. It was cheaper to make than the forged alloy wheel, although it was not as strong. This new 6j x 15 wheel, made by the german company ATS and known as the 'cookie-cutter' because of its appearance, was standard on 1973 Model year E, and would remain in use until 1983.

Derdens: In 1967 kon eender welke 911 or 912 met fuchsen worden geleverd als optie. 4.5 inch modellen zijn hondsduur aangezien de Kever boys ze gebruiken voor hun opgepepte beetles

4.5" 901.361.012.01 42mm positive offset
5.5" 901.361.012.04 42mm positive offset
6.0" 901.361.012.00 36mm positive offset
7.0" 901.361.012.05 49mm positive offset

Fuchs means fox in German. There is a little caricature of a fox's head stamped on the backs of all early Fuchs. Some earlies have it on the hub. But, most are adjacent to the "901..." part number. The fox heads on the hub are much larger than the ones appearing next to the "901..." number.

There is also a date stamp on the back of the hub. It will have the month and year. For example: "1 67" - January 1967. There are also other various esoteric forging numbers, letters, characters, etc. that the manufacturer used. These differ widely even among same size & date wheels.

Many early 4.5's have no "part" numbers stamped on them. These "part numbers" were originally forging numbers used by the Fuch company and not "part" numbers. (Otto Fuchs Metallwerke, commonly referred to as "Fuchs," is the company that made the wheels for Porsche; there are many, many other kinds of "Fuch" wheels - you just wouldn't ever recognize them...) The forging numbers were commonly ground off after forging. Later, these forging numbers became part numbers...

It gets a little more confusing... Some early 6's have the .04 number - again, the numbers were used for forging purposes and i'm sure are right for however they kept track of them, or maybe a few workers were just lazy in changing the serial numbers... Again, they couldn't have been that important if they ground most of them off! I even have a set of 6's with "901...00" part numbers! Also, Fuchs first appeared in late '66. There were 5.5's, 6's, and 7R's in '66! There had to be. All Porsche's racers were using these cutting-edge wheels. Different wheels for different applications...

7.0's had a rubber stamp part number - the metal stamp was almost always (basically read "always") ground off. Also, the metal stamp would not be .05, it would be whatever number was being used to make the 6's at the time, since they used the same forging piece for the petals or spokes. However, the sides and backs are unique and very recognizeable to the R wheels. Thus, custom-made R wheels are easily identifiable. Some 6.0's even end with .00 (very early). {I have (4) of these wheels.} It's possible to have R's with .00 forging numbers too. 6.0 Fuchs made for the 911R race cars had a .03 ending part number. Now, those are some extremely rare wheels: {24 cars (4 prototypes and 20 production cars) x 2 wheels(fronts) = 46 + 23 spares = 59 total !!! Ever!!!}

Incidentally, in "901...04" the "0" refers to the center cap style (3-prong). The "4" eventually, referred to the wheel size... Is there an "901...02" ? Could be. Maybe a .02 modification was done and Porsche said, "Uh-uh. That doesn't work," and trashed the whole .02 series. There are other gaps in Porsche part number series and oftentimes this is the case...

There are no fake 4.5's - yet. Also, they would be easy to identify because of their weight and especially all the little details that would surely be lost in the casting process. All original Fuch alloys were forged wheels. This process is very expensive, but extremely effective in producing a strong wheel. The back of 4.5's are also unique...yet similar to R's.

In the May 2000 issue of Excellence on p.108 Jerry Sloniger states, "If we give the standard wheel a cost baseline of 1.0, Fuchs estimates that the hollow-spoke aluminum wheel has an index figure of 13.0, a mag wheel 16.0." That means quality wheels are 13 to 16 times as expensive to produce! As you know, most automakers will dive head first at the opportunity to cut costs and put out junk instead of quality - (my opinion.)

Fuchs' contract gave all the tooling to Porsche. Sadly, Porsche no longer has the tooling for the early 15" Fuchs. They still have the tooling for the 16" and did a run of 500 wheels some 6 or so years ago. Wish they could still do a run of earlies!.

vierdens: het verschil tussen de deep 6 en de normal 6





Voila! Hoop dat dit helpt.


Bert

[67driver]

zo, heb het setje gevolgd maar dik 1600 euro voor een paar velgen.. Dat is wel erg veel in mijn optiek.
Ik zoek verder, dus als iemand iets heeft of weet!

[Olaf]

zo, heb het setje gevolgd maar dik 1600 euro voor een paar velgen.. Dat is wel erg veel in mijn optiek.

Ik zou m'n optiek dan maar eens snel gaan veranderen

[Maarten]

Inderdaad. Ik weet niet in welke Porsche wereld jij leeft maar dit is wel zo'n beetje de prijs voor een setje redelijke vroege Fuchsen....

[drknauf]

valt nog mee , op essen classica stonden ze afgelopen april voor 4500 euro en dan moesten z nog opgeknapt worden

[Bertroex]

zo, heb het setje gevolgd maar dik 1600 euro voor een paar velgen.. Dat is wel erg veel in mijn optiek.

Welkom tot de swb porsche wereld. De prijzen van deze wagens en hun onderdelen -en laten we niet vergeten dat de 67 modellen uniek zijn daar ze vaak features hebben voor dat en alleen dat jaar- zijn zeer duur geworden, met alle gevolgen vandien.

Kijk het Early S registry er maar eens op na; ik ben zelf bezig om de onderdelen te verzamelen om 1 bepaalde 67 911R te re-creeren. Ik hoop het hele project onder de 100.000 sterling te houden: 997 turbo prijzen dus....

groeten uit Nottingham,


Bert

[Maarten]

Geinig project Bert. Kun je er al meer van vertellen?

[Bertroex]

Kun je er al meer van vertellen?

Well, Ik kan je in slaap krijgen met al de informatie maarre... wait and see


Ik denk tegen einde 2010 dat 'ie klaar is....

Beste groeten,


Bert

[Maarten]

And hear graag

[wolf]

67 911R re-creeren. hoop onder de 100.000 sterling

Bert, ik ga nu je psych bellen. Je bent weer gestopt met de pilletjes, he?